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А.ДУГИН: Я имею в виду, что здесь… я считаю, что есть так называемые границы цивилизации – это новое понятие, сейчас о нем говорит Хантингтон, об этом говорят сейчас многие политологи – это еще не правовое, не политическое, но уже политологическое понятие большого пространства или цивилизации. Есть нечто, что точно входит в российскую цивилизацию или в евразийскую цивилизацию. Конечно, там есть общие зоны, какие-то промежуточные, точных границ цивилизация не имеет – есть такие вот расплывчатые границы, но например совершенно ясно, что границы цивилизации, одна из них проходит по Збручу. И вот западная Украина никак в нашу цивилизацию не входит вообще: там есть анклавы, православные, русейные, но это явно не наши. То есть это нужно завоевать и держать зубами. У нас для этого совершенно нет ни сил, ни возможностей, ну это просто нам не схватит, не проглотить. Прибалтика, которая была под нами, которая вышла из под нас первыми, и которую удержать можно только какими-то страшными вещами, на которые мы не готовы ни морально, ни психологически, ни физически, она уже отрезанный ломоть. Но что-то еще не отрезанный ломоть, в том числе те анклавы, о которых мы говорим. И если мы сейчас не утвердим там наше влияние, стратегическое влияние и политическое влияние, какое угодно, военное влияние, то нам это потом.
А.ДУГИН: …Тот кто не может защитить суверенитет, тот не суверенен, он будет под кем-то.
А.ДУГИН: Где остановят, честно говоря, Матвей. Вот где остановят – дотуда надо и доходить. Самое главное – есть явные анклавы, что называется, евразийские и российские цивилизации, то что с нами связано. Кто-то из них добровольно, доброжелательно, без всяких военных действий типа Казахстана, например, и Белоруссии готовы войти в нашу зону – они входят в ОДКБ, в ЕврАзЭс. А кто-то не готов.
А.ДУГИН: …Тот кто не может защитить суверенитет, тот не суверенен, он будет под кем-то.
А.ДУГИН: Где остановят, честно говоря, Матвей. Вот где остановят – дотуда надо и доходить. Самое главное – есть явные анклавы, что называется, евразийские и российские цивилизации, то что с нами связано. Кто-то из них добровольно, доброжелательно, без всяких военных действий типа Казахстана, например, и Белоруссии готовы войти в нашу зону – они входят в ОДКБ, в ЕврАзЭс. А кто-то не готов.
Joooooo,atėjo nauja bolševikinių banditų karta.Palikuonys tų,kur sadistiškai badu žudė ukrainiečius,Pavolgį.Dabartin iuose
kgbkomuniaginiuose mutantuose labai ryškiai bolše-
vikinių žmogėdrų genai prasiveržė.Šita bolševikinių banditų karta daug baisesnė.Jie deda skersą ant savo
liaudies išveždami milijardus iš Rusijos,namuose
paliko kvailinamą darbo liaudį,gudriai pamėtėdami
dvasinio ononizmo su pergalės diena,ar bronzinio
kareivėlio paminklo perkėlimu.Čia dzeržinskinis mutantas Putinas-nepakartojamas!!!!
Gruzija KETVIRTAME AMŽIUJE PRIĖMĖ KRIKŠČIONYBĘ!!!
Lyginant su burliokija,kurių gentis pradėjo krikštyti tūkstantmečių sandūroje,o vėliau krikštą tęsė mongolai kelis šimtus metų visa Gruzija
skeltanagiams turėtų būti šventovė,kalnų Jaruzalė.
Kojas balvonai turėtų nusivalyti ant tos žemės
atsistodami,jei save pradeda krikščionimis laikyti.
Jei ne-pats laikas Putkinui su Medvedevu prdėti
viešai protėvius zoologijos sode lankyti.Pats
laikas pradėti filmuotis beždžionėms oralinį
ar kunilingą darant ir rodant plačiai tėvyne.
Rodykite ,rupūžės,kaip šventoves sprogdinote,kaip
dvasininkus žudėte!!!Ar dar neužtenka sugriautų
šventovių,dar žmonių ašarų neprigėrėte,badu numarintų mėsa nepaspringote????
kgbkomuniaginiuose mutantuose labai ryškiai bolše-
vikinių žmogėdrų genai prasiveržė.Šita bolševikinių banditų karta daug baisesnė.Jie deda skersą ant savo
liaudies išveždami milijardus iš Rusijos,namuose
paliko kvailinamą darbo liaudį,gudriai pamėtėdami
dvasinio ononizmo su pergalės diena,ar bronzinio
kareivėlio paminklo perkėlimu.Čia dzeržinskinis mutantas Putinas-nepakartojamas!!!!
Gruzija KETVIRTAME AMŽIUJE PRIĖMĖ KRIKŠČIONYBĘ!!!
Lyginant su burliokija,kurių gentis pradėjo krikštyti tūkstantmečių sandūroje,o vėliau krikštą tęsė mongolai kelis šimtus metų visa Gruzija
skeltanagiams turėtų būti šventovė,kalnų Jaruzalė.
Kojas balvonai turėtų nusivalyti ant tos žemės
atsistodami,jei save pradeda krikščionimis laikyti.
Jei ne-pats laikas Putkinui su Medvedevu prdėti
viešai protėvius zoologijos sode lankyti.Pats
laikas pradėti filmuotis beždžionėms oralinį
ar kunilingą darant ir rodant plačiai tėvyne.
Rodykite ,rupūžės,kaip šventoves sprogdinote,kaip
dvasininkus žudėte!!!Ar dar neužtenka sugriautų
šventovių,dar žmonių ašarų neprigėrėte,badu numarintų mėsa nepaspringote????
Tai ziurim, ziurim. ir nematom jokios amerikoniskos propagandos nei Deutsche Welle, nei TV 5, nei BBC. O stai rusiski kanalai ir saitai isvis nieko daugiau ir nedaro, kaip kisa propaganda "ziniu" pavidale.
Tai kad melas tas Chinvalio "visiskas sugriovimas". O ir "miegantis miestas" irgi melas. Skerde gruzinu dar likusius tautiecius, patys parodomai isvezinejo vaikus ir ruosesi rusu gausesniam atejimui. Tiesiog - gruzinai smoge pirmieji ir teisingai padare.
Civil Georgia, Tbilisi / 13 Aug.'08 / 03:27
• Initial draft revised;
• EU FMs to discuss the plan;
• Resolution will be drafted for UNSC;
• Russian peacekeepers to remain;
• Internationalization possible later;
President Saakashvili said he had accepted EU-brokered principles on ceasefire plan, endorsed earlier on August 12 by Russia.
Speaking at a joint news conference after midnight with President Saakashvili after talks in Tbilisi, French President Nicola Sarkozy said that he had long and extensive discussions with the Georgian leader over the text of the agreement.
He said that some amendments have been made into the initial text of the agreement that was first unveiled in Moscow after the French President met with his Russian counterpart Dmitry Medvedev earlier on August 12.
Sarkozy, whose country holds the EU presidency, also said that because of the Georgian side’s insistence to make some amendments, he had to get in touch with President Medvedev twice during the talks and to agree those amendments with the Russian side.
The text, which is not signed by the sides, represents a political document of major principles outlining terms of ceasefire.
Bernard Kouchner, the French foreign minister, is expected to present the agreed text to the EU foreign ministers at the meeting on August 13 and then a resolution will be drafted presented to the UN Security Council for approval, the French President said.
Most of the principles of the agreement seem to remain unchanged from its initial draft agreed in Moscow.
But the Georgian side insisted to remove from the document a provision calling for launching “international discussions on the status of South Ossetia and Abkhazia and ways of providing their stable security.”
President Saakashvili said that this provision had been removed, because of its ambiguity, leaving room for different interpretations, including the possibility to question the Georgia’s territorial integrity.
“We do not want to leave any doubt about [about the matter] - and I think President Sarkozy agrees with that; the territorial integrity of Georgia can never be put under doubt under any kind of international process. This is out of question,” Saakashvili said.
The first principle is non-use of forces and that applies, the French President said, “to all the parties – Ossetians, Abkhaz, Russia, Georgia.”
He said that the second principle was to cease hostilities. “At this point this is provisional, but the intent is to make it permanent,” Sarkozy said.
Free access to humanitarian aid and addressing the needs of displaced persons is the third point of the agreement. “Mr. Kouchner will be overlooking this,” Sarkozy said.
Under the fourth point the Georgian side undertakes commitment to return its forces to their original positions. And the Russian side will also pull its troops from the region.
But it only applies to those additional forces which Russia deployed in the region after the launch of hostilities in South Ossetia. Russian peacekeepers, which are stationed in the region for over a decade already, will remain there at least for now.
The fifth point of the agreement reads that the Russian peacekeeping forces “take additional security measures before creation of international mechanisms.”
President Saakashvili said that this provision meant undertaking of a commitment by all the sides, including by the western powers, that the peacekeeping operation in the region will be internationalized.
“Although there should be temporary arrangements for now, but later it should be replaced by international process with participation of EU, UN,” Saakashvili said. “What we have clearly obtained at this stage is cessation of hostilities and withdrawal of the occupational forces. We have temporary arrangement with the [Russian] peacekeepers – fine; but then there should be internationalization of the process and we have the commitment of all sides.”
“Of course this is a political document, but general principles are there. We need legal details; we need Security Council resolution and we need more presence international observers on the ground and more internationalization of the entire process.”
Giorgi Baramidze, the Georgian state minister for Euro-Atlantic integration issues, said that the document did not contain any specific timeframes. “It calls for ‘an immediate’ halt of hostilities and disengagement of forces,” he told Civil.Ge.
• Initial draft revised;
• EU FMs to discuss the plan;
• Resolution will be drafted for UNSC;
• Russian peacekeepers to remain;
• Internationalization possible later;
President Saakashvili said he had accepted EU-brokered principles on ceasefire plan, endorsed earlier on August 12 by Russia.
Speaking at a joint news conference after midnight with President Saakashvili after talks in Tbilisi, French President Nicola Sarkozy said that he had long and extensive discussions with the Georgian leader over the text of the agreement.
He said that some amendments have been made into the initial text of the agreement that was first unveiled in Moscow after the French President met with his Russian counterpart Dmitry Medvedev earlier on August 12.
Sarkozy, whose country holds the EU presidency, also said that because of the Georgian side’s insistence to make some amendments, he had to get in touch with President Medvedev twice during the talks and to agree those amendments with the Russian side.
The text, which is not signed by the sides, represents a political document of major principles outlining terms of ceasefire.
Bernard Kouchner, the French foreign minister, is expected to present the agreed text to the EU foreign ministers at the meeting on August 13 and then a resolution will be drafted presented to the UN Security Council for approval, the French President said.
Most of the principles of the agreement seem to remain unchanged from its initial draft agreed in Moscow.
But the Georgian side insisted to remove from the document a provision calling for launching “international discussions on the status of South Ossetia and Abkhazia and ways of providing their stable security.”
President Saakashvili said that this provision had been removed, because of its ambiguity, leaving room for different interpretations, including the possibility to question the Georgia’s territorial integrity.
“We do not want to leave any doubt about [about the matter] - and I think President Sarkozy agrees with that; the territorial integrity of Georgia can never be put under doubt under any kind of international process. This is out of question,” Saakashvili said.
The first principle is non-use of forces and that applies, the French President said, “to all the parties – Ossetians, Abkhaz, Russia, Georgia.”
He said that the second principle was to cease hostilities. “At this point this is provisional, but the intent is to make it permanent,” Sarkozy said.
Free access to humanitarian aid and addressing the needs of displaced persons is the third point of the agreement. “Mr. Kouchner will be overlooking this,” Sarkozy said.
Under the fourth point the Georgian side undertakes commitment to return its forces to their original positions. And the Russian side will also pull its troops from the region.
But it only applies to those additional forces which Russia deployed in the region after the launch of hostilities in South Ossetia. Russian peacekeepers, which are stationed in the region for over a decade already, will remain there at least for now.
The fifth point of the agreement reads that the Russian peacekeeping forces “take additional security measures before creation of international mechanisms.”
President Saakashvili said that this provision meant undertaking of a commitment by all the sides, including by the western powers, that the peacekeeping operation in the region will be internationalized.
“Although there should be temporary arrangements for now, but later it should be replaced by international process with participation of EU, UN,” Saakashvili said. “What we have clearly obtained at this stage is cessation of hostilities and withdrawal of the occupational forces. We have temporary arrangement with the [Russian] peacekeepers – fine; but then there should be internationalization of the process and we have the commitment of all sides.”
“Of course this is a political document, but general principles are there. We need legal details; we need Security Council resolution and we need more presence international observers on the ground and more internationalization of the entire process.”
Giorgi Baramidze, the Georgian state minister for Euro-Atlantic integration issues, said that the document did not contain any specific timeframes. “It calls for ‘an immediate’ halt of hostilities and disengagement of forces,” he told Civil.Ge.
tai o kokį sprendimą siūlai? :/
prakaituoji, vis dar nemiegi, jooo tikras urakremlinis fanatas
Rusai nutraukė žudynes. Geriau vėliau, negu niekad, kaip ta sena pana sėsdama ant vinies. Ir aš džiaugiuos, nes nieko bjauresnio už karą nežinau. O kai nušluojami ištisi miestai, tai išvis... Niekas man neįrodys, kad naktį apšaudant miegantį miestą atstatoma konstitucinė tvarka. Kai žūsta taikūs gyventojai šaly įvedinėjant tvarką-tai policinė valstybė. Ir dar toj valstybėj kažkaip keistai žūva opozicijos atstovai. Ir žmonės kurie perdaug žino. Todėl manau kad šiam kare atitiko kirvis kotą. Abi pusės prisižaidė .Todėl dabar pirmiausia reik sustabdyt generolus, nes jiems dar noris pakariaut. Tai įmanoma tik konflikte nedalyvaujančių tarptautinių pajėgų pagrindu. Rusija šimtmečiais buvo krikščionybės gynėja ir taikos garantu Kaukaze. Tokį vaidmenį ji pasirinko ir dabar. Tačiau bėda, kad ji mano visad esanti teisi. Net jei yra neteisi. O gruzinai jau vieną kart sušaudė savo parlamentą, per 17 Nepriklausomybės metų 7 kart kariavo su savo piliečiais , todėl nebeturiu sentimentų dėl jų pasiruošimo tapti ES ir NATO nariais. Gal po kokių 10 metų, jei nesusinaikins galėsim grįžti prie šio klausymo.
Tokios valstybės valdomos žiniasklaidos priemonės kaip „Vesti“ pareiškė, kad Gruzija pirma įsiveržė į Pietų Osetiją
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tai kad lygtai taip ir buvo? Bent jau LT mass media pirma pranešė, kad gruzinai įsiveržė o paskui tik gavo atgal.
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tai kad lygtai taip ir buvo? Bent jau LT mass media pirma pranešė, kad gruzinai įsiveržė o paskui tik gavo atgal.
a vis dar prakaituoji
REKLAMA
REKLAMA
Antrasis frontas: Kremliaus ideologinis karas Rusijoje